New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

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a.p.k.
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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by a.p.k. » Sun Nov 20, 2011 4:06 pm

BethMI wrote:
marilaine wrote:I still cried when they show Severus' death and memories. I get the feeling I'm gonna bawl every single time I watch.

~ML :twisted: :cool:
I'm with you there. {sighs and frowns} I know JK didn't like Severus' character at all. So, we are lucky that she "redeemed" him in the end ... but still ... he's a potion's master for crying out loud. He is second hand to a maniac that keeps a pet snake. Do you seriously think that he wouldn't have antidotes, blood replenishing potion, coagulants, etc on him?

...
~Beth from Michigan


Okay, so I'm really not supposed to be here, work backlog is insane, but here on a break and saw this post and just had to reply. (And admitting to cutting&pasting from a post I'd written elsewhere.)



I respectfully and vehemently and intensely disagree.

She *didn't* like Severus? On the contrary. To an extreme degree. She *adored* him.




Nobody in her books is perfect. Except maybe Lily. There you go. Lily, as written, is perfect. Loving, loyal, earthmothersupreme, and her only apparent loss of temper or moment of imperfection is when she’s been pushed to the extreme of being taunted in an extremely public racist way.

By Snape.

Who throughout the books is, yes, all imperfection, no redeeming features whatsoever … until the very end of the last book, when we discover that he was raised in a miserably dysfunctional home (excusing away some of his bad behavior) and that he did it all for love (excusing away the rest of his bad behavior). He’s shown to be more loyal than the rest, more courageous than the rest, more brilliant than the rest, and to truly love on a level that the rest can only aspire to. And … the only perfect character in the books truly loved him right back.

I’d say she adores Severus. And that even that is an understatement.

Editing to add that she even gives us a kick in the gut in the epilogue, just to make sure we all feel sufficiently guilty for having so horribly misjudged her beloved Severus all through the rest of the books.

Adoration? Way past it.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by Marie » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:55 am

Very insightful JPK. I sort of felt it but never really could put it into words - you did so beautifully. I know that JK told both Coltrane and Rickman that they needed to trust her and that she had some great things in mind for their characters in future books. I'd say she told them true.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by LadySekhmet » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:28 pm

Yes, I agree with you ladies. If she didn't love Snape, then how could so many of us have soaked so many tissues while reading and watching his final scenes? She wrote him so deftly. And Rickman played him so well that while you sort of knew that Snape had deep painful secrets, but you were not so sure how much they influenced his life experience.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by marilaine » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:42 pm

Too true. I still sob like a baby when I see his memories. My sister asked "Why are you crying?"
"It's my Potter and I'll cry if I want to."

~ML *teammalfoy* :loco :brows :cool:

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by BethMI » Wed Nov 23, 2011 5:06 am

Um ... well I'd like to say that the information I had about her not liking Snape actually came from an interview that I read or watched with her. So ... don't really know what to say back on it except that it was her words at the time. Maybe she changed her mind, I don't know, but she stated it clearly at the time.

~Beth from Michigan

a.p.k. wrote:
BethMI wrote:
marilaine wrote:I still cried when they show Severus' death and memories. I get the feeling I'm gonna bawl every single time I watch.

~ML :twisted: :cool:
I'm with you there. {sighs and frowns} I know JK didn't like Severus' character at all. So, we are lucky that she "redeemed" him in the end ... but still ... he's a potion's master for crying out loud. He is second hand to a maniac that keeps a pet snake. Do you seriously think that he wouldn't have antidotes, blood replenishing potion, coagulants, etc on him?

...
~Beth from Michigan


Okay, so I'm really not supposed to be here, work backlog is insane, but here on a break and saw this post and just had to reply. (And admitting to cutting&pasting from a post I'd written elsewhere.)



I respectfully and vehemently and intensely disagree.

She *didn't* like Severus? On the contrary. To an extreme degree. She *adored* him.




Nobody in her books is perfect. Except maybe Lily. There you go. Lily, as written, is perfect. Loving, loyal, earthmothersupreme, and her only apparent loss of temper or moment of imperfection is when she’s been pushed to the extreme of being taunted in an extremely public racist way.

By Snape.

Who throughout the books is, yes, all imperfection, no redeeming features whatsoever … until the very end of the last book, when we discover that he was raised in a miserably dysfunctional home (excusing away some of his bad behavior) and that he did it all for love (excusing away the rest of his bad behavior). He’s shown to be more loyal than the rest, more courageous than the rest, more brilliant than the rest, and to truly love on a level that the rest can only aspire to. And … the only perfect character in the books truly loved him right back.

I’d say she adores Severus. And that even that is an understatement.

Editing to add that she even gives us a kick in the gut in the epilogue, just to make sure we all feel sufficiently guilty for having so horribly misjudged her beloved Severus all through the rest of the books.

Adoration? Way past it.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by a.p.k. » Wed Nov 23, 2011 3:26 pm

If you read/watch her interviews through the decade she spent writing the books, you'll often hear her call Snape "nasty" or "horrid" or "horrible." And that's absolutely how she wrote him. And that's exactly how I said she wrote him. Quoting myself: "[Snape as written] throughout the books is, yes, all imperfection, no redeeming features whatsoever." Nasty, horrid, and horrible indeed. And all the while she was writing him this way and telling us about him in interviews, she had this backstory.

And that backstory remained untold to anyone (except, she admits now, to Alan Rickman). Until book 7.

:-)



And there's no need to get all "um" huffy, you know? It's just different interpretations of the same material. And I stand by my interpretation: Absolute adoration.

Peace.






BethMI wrote:Um ... well I'd like to say that the information I had about her not liking Snape actually came from an interview that I read or watched with her. So ... don't really know what to say back on it except that it was her words at the time. Maybe she changed her mind, I don't know, but she stated it clearly at the time.

~Beth from Michigan

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by Angel Tavington » Wed Nov 23, 2011 4:10 pm

thunder wrote:Here's more extra material. It's from "focus points", and they talk about Lucius and how he changed and how they changed his costume with the change... comes on at around 0:40

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BzhPUDmte8
Thanks Thunder for your contributions!!!



~me

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by BethMI » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:26 pm

I wasn't being huffy at all. I said Um because I was confused about how strongly all of that post came and unsure what to say except what I'd read/seen in the interviews. It wasn't that she just said that the character she wrote was nasty. She said she didn't like the character and couldn't see how we found redeemable things in him. Now maybe that is an interpretation that she was just trying to say how she wrote the character, but at the time I know I wasn't the only one that was a bit bummed to know that she didn't like people liking the character.

So, in any case I was blown away by the vehemence of your post, but JK has had a habit of bringing out the strongest of emotions in people. I was surprised by it all, and I just wanted to post that I wasn't just spouting off unbacked nonsense. There was nothing huffy or angry about it. I was almost afraid to even post where I'd heard it from after your post (with others sounding in their support), but I didn't feel that it would be right for me to leave my comments hanging without sourcing them.

Honestly I love Severus Snape, and I have even before all of his "noble intentions" were revealed. Alan Rickman played him amazingly, and he was always one of my favorites along with Jason Isaacs as Lucius. Heck Alan Rickman was one of the few reasons I even gave the Harry Potter movies a try. I have enjoyed many of his acting roles (evil and good), and I figured if he could be in something like this ... it had to be worth a try. If it wasn't for him and Richard Harris, I never would have let my friends force me to watch the first movie on DVD. Of course the second one came along, which I believe was the first one I watched in a theatre, and I was hooked on Jason's performance as Lucius.

Also adoration or not, I still don't think her killing him off was as plausible as it seemed. As I said before ... he was a potion's master who knew that his "master" kept that snake close by. Severus, being the man that he is and pretty much always prepared, wouldn't have been one not to anticipate what happened. Yes, it was more dramatic for it to happen, but I still say it shouldn't have happened that way.

~Beth from Michigan

a.p.k. wrote:If you read/watch her interviews through the decade she spent writing the books, you'll often hear her call Snape "nasty" or "horrid" or "horrible." And that's absolutely how she wrote him. And that's exactly how I said she wrote him. Quoting myself: "[Snape as written] throughout the books is, yes, all imperfection, no redeeming features whatsoever." Nasty, horrid, and horrible indeed. And all the while she was writing him this way and telling us about him in interviews, she had this backstory.

And that backstory remained untold to anyone (except, she admits now, to Alan Rickman). Until book 7.

:-)



And there's no need to get all "um" huffy, you know? It's just different interpretations of the same material. And I stand by my interpretation: Absolute adoration.

Peace.






BethMI wrote:Um ... well I'd like to say that the information I had about her not liking Snape actually came from an interview that I read or watched with her. So ... don't really know what to say back on it except that it was her words at the time. Maybe she changed her mind, I don't know, but she stated it clearly at the time.

~Beth from Michigan

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by BethMI » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:27 pm

{cheers} I agree. You are awesome Thunder ... and everyone that sent links for the various interviews, movie mode extras, screen shots, etc. They are a delight to see!

~Beth from Michigan

Angel Tavington wrote:
thunder wrote:Here's more extra material. It's from "focus points", and they talk about Lucius and how he changed and how they changed his costume with the change... comes on at around 0:40

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0BzhPUDmte8
Thanks Thunder for your contributions!!!



~me

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by Helen8 » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:58 pm

Okay. Two little letters-–U and m–-written together, can be interpreted in many different ways.

Well-written stories are meant to be discussed. Friendly board. Friendly discussions. Debate is a good thing. Personalities and feelings shouldn't enter into it here, Mates. We can't "hear" the inflection in our written words, so please don't assume that an attack was made.

Lotus position, please.
Ommmmmmmmmmmm. Ommmmmmmmmmm.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by a.p.k. » Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:00 pm

Definitely, my post was vehement. I even said I "vehemently" disagree. LOL

All part of discussion, isn't it? Sure, I could've said, "Like, maybe okay I kinda sorta think that is it possible that" etc., etc., etc., which would definitely have been less vehement. Though not sure why that's be preferable, because a difference of opinion is allowed in polite company, isn't it?




:stirrer
Personally, I can't stand Snape. Never understood the obsession with him at all. Don't even like Alan Rickman much. LOL Though I do think he's great as Snape. And yeah, his whole story arc makes me absolutely :bawl ...





:furthermore
And now the disagreement bit goes further, and please don't be more upset with me, but anyway, even the greatest and most brilliant minds can't save themselves from war. There's a whole lot of fury with JKR for the deaths in her books, and particularly those in book 7 (not saying that you're furious, Beth, just talking in the general "royal you" sense). But war is like that. People die. No matter how knowledgeable they are or how prepared they might be ...

:bag:
... she says as she reminds herself to remind her (chemist!) husband that he was supposed to order our family's gas masks from the bureaucrats-that-be this week and he hasn't yet and the week is almost over. LOL (Well, he's an unemployed chemist at the moment, but still a chemist. Knows a lot about chemistry. And gasses. Like that'll help us any. LOL)




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Ommmmmmmmmmmm. Ommmmmmmmmmm.
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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by LadySekhmet » Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:02 am

What? Me? Furious? No, I'm thinking of tomorrow's turkey. :D (just kidding to lighten our mood!!) I'm a Beth, too. There seems to be a glut of Beths here...or would that be a murder of Beths? A herd? Anywhoo...

I have to admit that I also often wondered if JRK was playing "the game" of telling the media one thing, but doing her own thing in the background. It would make great sense for all of the story arcs of her books if she did- laying a false trail and all that. No matter how she really feels about Snape, she did the wizard man good in the end (he becomes a true tragic hero in the defined sense of the term), just as she did the Malfoys good, too. (I'm sorry, dear Lucius, I will have to say this out loud: I also often wonder how she really felt about Lucius. He'd be an easy wizard to despise as well. (All of my friends can attest to that- I am a lone voice of 'Lucius love' in my group of friends!))

(And - to be honest- it's getting hard to keep the books and movies separate-they seem to be blending... :uhoh )

LadySekhmet (also a Beth)

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by a.p.k. » Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:59 am

LadySekhmet wrote:What? Me? Furious? No, I'm thinking of tomorrow's turkey. :D (just kidding to lighten our mood!!) I'm a Beth, too. There seems to be a glut of Beths here...or would that be a murder of Beths? A herd? Anywhoo...

I have to admit that I also often wondered if JRK was playing "the game" of telling the media one thing, but doing her own thing in the background. It would make great sense for all of the story arcs of her books if she did- laying a false trail and all that. No matter how she really feels about Snape, she did the wizard man good in the end (he becomes a true tragic hero in the defined sense of the term), just as she did the Malfoys good, too. (I'm sorry, dear Lucius, I will have to say this out loud: I also often wonder how she really felt about Lucius. He'd be an easy wizard to despise as well. (All of my friends can attest to that- I am a lone voice of 'Lucius love' in my group of friends!))

(And - to be honest- it's getting hard to keep the books and movies separate-they seem to be blending... :uhoh )

LadySekhmet (also a Beth)


Oh, I've no doubt that she (JKR) utterly despised Lucius. She never gave him any redeeming features at all. The closest he gets to redemption is backing out of the fight at the end to search for his son ... but that's just self-interest at work. He doesn't (or maybe doesn't get the chance to) do anything to put himself firmly on the path of redemption (like, say, Narcissa does, and Draco as well). Though that would be the next logical step.

And it's fun to imagine that he does take that step eventually. Which is why we have fanfiction. :D

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by inamac » Thu Nov 24, 2011 4:38 am

a.p.k. wrote:
Oh, I've no doubt that she (JKR) utterly despised Lucius. She never gave him any redeeming features at all. The closest he gets to redemption is backing out of the fight at the end to search for his son ... but that's just self-interest at work. He doesn't (or maybe doesn't get the chance to) do anything to put himself firmly on the path of redemption (like, say, Narcissa does, and Draco as well). Though that would be the next logical step.

And it's fun to imagine that he does take that step eventually. Which is why we have fanfiction. :D
I've always wondered whether the absolute humiliation JKR heaps on Lucius in Deathly Hallows was a direct result of Jason Isaacs *begging* her to let him out of Azkaban (as a writer myself I take some delight in twisting the expectations and desires of my readers) Yes, she let him out - but was he really any better off?

As for Snape - She's said that she didn't like the person on whom the character is based - I wonder whether some people (and Jo herself?) have confused that with a dislike of the character himself? I don't know whether I'd be generous enough to take a character based on someone I hated, and turn him into a sort of hero. The problem with writing is that once it's out and published the interpretation is for the reader to make. And in the case of the films that interpretation is filtered through writer, director and actor - all of whom may have completely different ideas.

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Re: New Maximum Movie Mode video(s)

Post by LadySekhmet » Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:52 pm

Yes, inamac, that is why we who love Lucius will always make him redeemable in our minds. :cherub

I know it makes sense for Narcissa to be the one who starts the redemption (motherly love and all), but it would've been interesting to see Lucius' attempt at a familial redemption. Ah well, c'est la vie! Yes, that is why there is (good) fanfic.

Well, I suppose there were pros and cons to being let out Azkaban - the biggest pro being that he was simply not there, and the largest con being that his house was invaded by the creepiest person in the known universe and he never knew if or when his head would be next on the chopping block.

Yes, I agree with you. I think that JRK would have to be a fairly generous hearted person -if she did base him on a person she hated.

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